Dr. Rhonda Patrick: I think this is a good segue into these sort of exercise snacks. Now, some people would consider a 10-minute workout even on the longer end of an exercise snack. So exercise snacks are, they can be structured or unstructured. And I talked about this with Dr. Martin Gibala a lot. He's been involved in a lot of studies involving the unstructured type of exercise snacks, but the structured type of exercise snack is something where you're getting your heart rate really high, at least 80% of your max heart rate, right? You're getting more into that, that vigorous-intensity zone. And it could be anywhere from 1 minute to 9 minutes, perhaps 10 minutes where you're, you're doing intervals, right?

If you're doing 10 minutes, not like the entire 10 minutes you're in that, but you're, you're doing intervals. But if you're doing a 1-minute or 2-minute or 3-minute workout, then you can, you can, you can be in a pretty high, 85% of your maximum heart rate zone, right? So some examples would be something like bodyweight squats, or you do high knees or burpees or jumping jacks for some people, lunges, right? Something where you're, you're engaging multiple muscle groups and you're also just getting your heart rate up as well. So those would be the structured types of exercise snacks. There's also the unstructured type where people just throughout their, their daily activities that they're doing will engage in an exercise snack.

So these are called vigorous intermittent lifestyle physical activity or VILPA. And this is typically someone who, let's say their office is on the 3rd or 4th floor of a building and they sprint as, you know, they sprint up the stairs, they go fast up the stairs, maybe not technically sprint because a coach would be like, no way. And you're right, but no way. But they're going faster down, they're not just walking, they're going fast, their heart rate's getting up. And they do that multiple times a day or they walk and instead of just walking, they're really briskly walking, they're going really fast, right? And there's other examples of this sort of unstructured type of, you know, house cleaning sometimes, right? People are like going around and vacuuming and they're kind of fast.

Like, you know, I've, I've, I've seen that being the case as well. So there's a lot of types of unstructured exercise that can be done. And there's a, a variety of benefits that are associated with this sort of these exercise snacks. And when Dr. Martin Gibala, when he came on the podcast, he was talking a lot about these VILPA studies where researchers give people that are engaging in this type of unstructured exercise an accelerometer. So this is measuring their heart rate and they're, they're able to see their heart rate and also like, I guess the distance as well, but it's, it's also measuring their heart rate and they're seeing how high their heart rate goes.

And then they've looked at a variety of outcomes, all-cause mortality, cardiovascular-related mortality, cancer-related mortality. And what these publications, which Dr. Martin Gibala has been a part of, have shown is that people that are engaging in this type of VILPA exercise, this unstructured exercise for 1 to 2 minutes, 3 times a day. So you're getting up to the 9-minute-a-day range. They have a 50% reduction in all-cause mortality, cardiovascular-related mortality, and a 40% reduction in cancer-related mortality. And these are even, these are benefits that are even found in people that identify as non-exercisers.

So in other words, they don't consider themselves, they don't go to the gym, they're not doing tennis or, you know, dance class or whatever, they're, they, they consider themselves like not doing physical activity. So I think that, that, that data really kind of drives home that even these small sort of bursts of physical activity can be beneficial for health. Then there's also a lot of psychological benefits that Dr. Martin Gibala talked about as well. With the exercise snacks, it obviously, I think that psychologically, you know, knowing that you have to just exercise for 1 to 2 minutes at a time, it feels easier.

And so one of their, I think, goals with these exercise snacks and doing these actual studies was one of the barriers to exercise for some people is, oh, I have to exercise for 30 to 40 minutes at a time. I don't really want to, to do that. Now, people should probably learn to do that, but you know, for people who may not comply with that, it feels psychologically easier than long workouts and they don't really require any special equipment. If you are doing them throughout the day while you're working at a job, you don't even have to change your clothes. And so it just removes that psychological barrier that I have to get dressed and go to the gym and exercise for 30 minutes at a time.

With exercise snacks, you're doing it for 1 to 5 minutes and then it's over and you just do it a few times per day. So psychologically they feel easier. These consistent small efforts also appear to enhance adherence. And so when they conduct these studies, they find that adherence is pretty high as compared to maybe some of the exercise training studies where people don't necessarily do all the exercise that they're prescribed, especially if it's supposed to be at home and it's, you know, it doesn't require them coming into the lab. So those are kind of 2 of the psychological benefits, and I think those can be leveraged by, again, maybe non-exercisers, but also people who exercise. But there are a lot of physiological benefits to the exercise snacks as well.

Brady Holmer: I mean, there are multiple studies by Dr. Martin Gibala and colleagues showing people improve their VO2 max just by doing these exercise snacks 4 to 5 times per day for a few times per week. They can improve cardiometabolic health, so they can improve their blood pressure, reduce their fasting blood glucose, improve their HbA1c. So measures of body composition, glucose regulation, all of these can improve with exercise snacks, which is profound. I think one thing to note, I think, is that these people were previously untrained. So I don't think you could take somebody who's exercising at a level of maybe what you and I are doing, Rhonda, and do exercise snacks. And you're gonna see these huge health benefits, especially like VO2 max. But I— certainly think that they can be additive.

So if you are exercising and you add these exercise snacks, you can receive additional health benefits, but you might not see a, you know, 50% improvement in your VO2 max by doing exercise snacks. But studies have shown that. And so I think they can be very potent in doing that as well and showing that it doesn't require a large time investment just to see a fitness improvement. And then I think one of the other benefits is that they break up sedentary time throughout the day. So we know that being sedentary, sitting for say, 30 to 60 minutes or longer, or maybe 3 hours at a time is not good for cardiometabolic health. So breaking up your sedentary time as much as possible is good.

And so physically, psychologically, just for the cognitive benefits too, using these exercise snacks intermittently throughout the day can improve physical health by reducing sedentary time and keep you more focused by reducing your kind of the cognitive maybe slump that you get after you sit for 3 hours or so at a time.

Dr. Rhonda Patrick: It also helps with the, the like midday slumpiness, like where you're feeling kind of sleepy. And I cannot drink caffeine in the afternoon. Like I, for me, it affects me and I'll be, I'll be up too late in the evening. So I will get up and do some bodyweight squats. Usually it's bodyweight squats. Sometimes I'll do some pushups or something, but something that just gets my heart rate up and blood flowing. And what do you know? I feel better, right? I'm ready.

I'm more focused, ready to get back to work as well. And, the other thing that's really good with the exercise snacks is to time them around meals. And, there's also been some evidence on this published looking at mostly people with metabolic dysfunction like type 2 diabetes, metabolic syndrome, and how even doing something timed around a meal, and it doesn't have to be long, it can be a short, again, you're doing some bodyweight squats or burpees or jumping jacks, whatever, it improves glucose regulation, right? And so, it's something that you can, I typically will do it if I'm— going out to dinner. Certainly when I'm on vacation and I don't eat the way I usually eat on my, my, my usual disciplined diet where it's like, okay, we're in Italy and we're having gelato. Guess what?

I'm like next to the gelato station and I'm doing bodyweight squats. It's like, so I mean, it's something that can be used as a tool for like you, like you mentioned, improving cardiometabolic health and also timing it around times when maybe you're cheating a little bit more as well.

Brady Holmer: Sure. And also, you know, can be used if you feel like you don't have enough time with your main training sessions during your week to kind of meet the minimum recommended level of physical activity. I think the exercise snacks again can be additive so they can be used to kind of bring your total exercise volume during the week up to meet those activity levels or sneak in maybe extra exercise if you don't find you have the time or you miss a training session, or maybe there's a day where you just don't have the time to dedicate to an actual training session.

I'm gonna do exercise snacks today and that could be a suitable alternative.

Dr. Rhonda Patrick: Very good point. Yeah. And also, that psychologically feels good, right? Like I'm checking that box, right?

Brady Holmer: They do.

Dr. Rhonda Patrick: Yeah. I do exercise snacks during the day even though I'm training a lot, just again, mostly like for the psychological benefits. I'll do like some kettlebell swings, some pushups, some pullups, you know, they might help me build a little bit of strength, but definitely get that cognitive boost.